When will Barack Obama release his birth certificate?

FASCINATING!!!

How will we know if "Never" wins?

No, not so fascinating.... know where McCain was born? Not fascinating either...

I would love to see both BHO & John 'Lettuce' McCant disqualified

@theonecalledmichael - how can this not be fascinating, when it could disqualify the candidate you support?

I like to think people make informed decisions in the voting booth, not just being blind followers!

because... THESE arguments, about barack and mccain, came up months ago.... non-issue.... on both sides... not fascinating, not even notworthy... this is old news, and it was proven to be false news...

ok cool - we should be able to settle this question then... do you have a link to the image of his birth certificate?

yep, "not even notworthy"... it's even worthy ;-)

has any HD'S ran for prez of usa? i'm guessing (since i've never run for prez) that you gotta prove your eligible. again guessing..that would require lots of paper work. i guess anybody could have forged documents. we supposely got 40+ millon illegals running around in the usa. they prolly got a few forged documents. i would think to get people to shut up ombama would release his birth certiicate.

@dieseldog - Not yet... but if I announce my candidacy I would appreciate your endorsement 8^)

If his birth name is "Barry Dunham", how will he ever explain "Barack Hussein Obamama"?

This government is so broken they probably don't even ask for a birth certificate when candidates file their papers to run for president.

@markov > yeah they probably don't. They didn't start asking about ID and citizenship questions for voters until recently, and that isn't even enforced

A jpeg image of Barack Obama's birth certificate is here: <http://images.dailykos.com/images/user/3/BO_Birth_Certificate.jpg>

(As reported by National Review ...)

are we sure that's a legit birth certificate? I note it states father's race as african. African is not a race. It's a continent.

I didn't think we were using blogs (dailykos) as "major mainstream news sources."

@Erik - he released it on his own webpage: http://my.barackobama.com/page/invite/birthcert

This image looks photoshopped to me.

Here are some details about this image that others have noticed: http://suitablyflip.com/suitably_flip/2008/06/kos-tries-to-pa.html

This was interesting -> In order to process your application, DHHL utilizes information that is found only on the original Certificate of Live Birth, which is either black or green. This is a more complete record of your birth than the Certification of Live Birth (a computer-generated printout)

http://www.macsmind.com/wordpress/2008/06/12/koss-obama-birth-certificate-fake/

Ok, I'll say again.. This is not a question of whether or not a blogger is lying. Obama posted the certificate on his own website. So either 1) Its a real certificate and he gave it to Kos, 2) He's somehow badly forged a birth certificate to cheat his way into the presidency... I know the conspiracy theorists will try to argue #2, but I think Occam's razor applies here.

I think the flag pin is a bigger issue than this is (and I REALLY don't think the flag pin is a real issue). Can we talk about tax reform and Iraq now?

(Ends snit, goes to bed)

Well, I doubt Obama posted anything on his website. He has a team that does that, and several time has apparently posted things that he later asked them to take down....

Here are two examples:
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/03/obama-may-want-to-rethink-his-new-black.html
http://sweetness-light.com/archive/pastor-wright-erased-from-obamas-website

My point is that if Obama wanted to prove anything, he would have them post a Certificate of Live Birth, (which is much more detailed) on his website. This is the official document that has the seal of the State of Hawaii embossed on it.

Here's where the forgery potentially originated... note the time on the blank copy

http://s100.photobucket.com/albums/m35/opendna/?action=view¤t=HI_birthcert_corvo.jpg

i can't prove nor disprove if thats a legit birth certificate. my question is..has anybody head BHO called jr? on the birth certificate his and his dad's name is the same. i've never heard him called jr.

Barack Hussein Obama, Jr
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama

thanks fof.

This settled too early. What is posted under settlement details is a Certificate of Live Birth, not a Birth Certificate. In the states, these are two entirely different documents. The market clearly asks, "When will Barack Obama release his birth certificate?"

Another version of the so-called birth certificate appears here:
http://atrueobamanation.blogspot.com/2008/06/america-is-obamanation-exclusive-barack.html

@Erik LOL - that is hilarous!

As to your other comment, yes this was settled without a Birth Certificate. A certification of live birth is something else entirely, and shouldn't have been accepted as a substitute.

Get over it... McCain's birth certificate, as well as yours, is every bit as suspect as obama's.... no fingerprints, no dna, no photograph, a birth certificate is worthless.... both these guys are accepted as US natural born citizens...do you really think that we, at hubdub, would "uncover" some high level conspiracy that would disqualify either candidate?

@tocm uh - nobody was asking for fingerprints, dna, or photographs. This question was about releasing a birth certificate, which has not happened yet.

I hope his birth name is "Barry Dunham"

michael, I must agree with notable. No one is saying that there's a conspiracy. We're just saying that his birth certificate has not been released. Suspect or not, worthless or not. This market clearly asks about a birth certificate and to settle it with some other document is plainly wrong.

I agree with you all...there has been a series of loosening standards of settlement at hubdub, lately...

I don't have any $$ on this market, so I feel free to comment... the whole discussion about COLB vs. BC is rather ridiculous, and merely an example of someone trying to find a loophole in order to prevent losing a bucketload of H$.

The problem seems to be inconsistent use of the common sense test. I think the admins need to have the freedom to settle within "common sense", without worrying about people losing lots of $$. And perhaps it should be noted that Erik failed at two attempts (#13,#14) to say the market was improperly settled before arriving at one that worked. Perhaps the admin's should pay attention to such things when considering which opinion is rational.

Let me make just as silly an argument proving that the question was settled correctly initially. The term "birth certificate" was not capitalized in the question itself. Therefore, it does not refer specifically to the document titled "Birth Certificate". Rather, any certificate relating to birth is acceptable. Likewise, "Bloomin' Onion" refers specifically to Outback Steakhouse's version of the tasty dish. But "blooming onion" can be any "food dish consisting of one large fried vidalia onion which is cut to resemble a flower" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blooming_onion).

The point is... it is within the understanding of the major media, most everyone else who isn't trying to prove the certificate is a fake, and probably the author of the question that his BC was released.

Admins: please use the common sense test!
@Erik & notablenotices: why don't you just write a question asking if the BC posted on his site is a fake, or if he will release the "Birth Certificate" (capitalized)? That will give you plenty more screen space to discuss the finer points of US birth documents, photoshop, and so on.

(Just a clarification to the previous comment: I placed no $$ on the market prior to the re-opening. With a clarification regarding requiring a BC, I put H$500 on no release before election because there's no reason for it with a COLB already released!)

@triathematician - the original question was about rumors that had been circulated about Obama's qualifications to be President. These rumors would be cleared up with a "Certificate of Live Birth" (aka Birth Certificate).

What was released was a "Certification of Live Birth", which is not only much less detailed, but they can also actually be requested to be issued with data that has changed since the birth happened (name changes, for instance). Follow the links provided above for more details. I appreciate your concern, but please consider these details before trying to tell us what our motives were.

The "Certification of Live Birth" simply did not answer the questions raised by the rumors, which was the original question.

it could be beetle dung, for all i care, but inquiring minds want to know: was his birth name "Barry Dunham"

Oh my...triathematician, you donb't have a clue where I'm coming from. I had no money in this market prior to it being suspended. "And perhaps it should be noted that Erik failed at two attempts (#13,#14) to say the market was improperly settled before arriving at one that worked." Do you honestly think that the link I posted was serious? What raised my eyebrows was the relaxation of definitive settlements that have been occuring with increased frequency. I'm not concerned with rumors, inuendo, whether or not his certificate of live birth is legit, or even where Obama was born. That's not what this market is addressing. It's really quite simple. The market asks: When will Barack Obama release his birth certificate? He has not released his birth certificate. He has released a certificate of live birth and if you are in the US, you know that these are two different documents. Hubdub has been using "almost" and "close enough" with increasing frequency. In this case, settlement with a different document than what was asked for, was wrong.

I'm confused by the statement that the rumors at question were no cleared up, since the rumors described in the background seem to have been all cleared up by the COLB. Can you please provide a link or quote stating where someone in the media has stated that releasing the COLB did not clear up the original rumors? Also, I can't seem to find where it says that a COLB may include name changes.

@Erik: If the motivation is purely for the market to be settled "correctly", then I apologize for misunderstanding where you were coming from. But I stand by my assertion that capital letters should make a difference. A "birth certificate" could be either the "Birth Certificate" (actual document) or a "short form birth certificate" (the COLB that was released). If you write your state and ask them to send a copy of your birth certificate, they will probably send you the COLB, not a copy of the actual certificate (I have done this). And if you want to get real picky about it, why not require the actual original paper copy to be released? After all, if he does make a copy of his BC available, it's just a copy, not the actual BC.

My point is that there are two extremes that can be taken in settling a market. One extreme is to settle based on the precise language presented in the question and background, looking up the definitions of words if you have to, and perhaps even arguing over what the definition of "is" is. The other extreme is to settle the market based simply on rumor, speculation, etc. The admins have taken both approaches at times, and I have certainly not agreed with all settlements (in particular, the "when will HC concede" question settled before her concession speech). I think the best option is to "avoid all extremes" and to strike a balance. In this case, since a COLB is frequently referred to as a "birth certificate" and it wasn't stated precisely in the initial question, the settlement you suggest requires a "legalistic" (and somewhat inconsistent) point of view.

"If you write your state and ask them to send a copy of your birth certificate, they will probably send you the COLB, not a copy of the actual certificate"
That's exactly my point.
If you and I then made a wager that I had my birth certificate...I would loose.
Both a driver's license and a learner's permit allow one to drive. However, they are not the same thing.

my stomach turns to find myself on the same side as the one called micheal! This is not news worthy, just unfounded rumors. There is no way a major party would let someone who could not be president have their nomination, especially in this long and damaging fashion.

This whole controversy strikes me as remarkably racist. He is black, so he was born in Africa? Come on. He's black, so we need to actually see the certificate rather than take his and his parties word for it? Come on! I personally don't need to see a man's birth certificate before voting for or against him, I do that based on the actual person!

I can't believe that in this society, which is so PC it's frankly sickening, something like this can get so much attention. It looks like everyone is really concerned about race issues when it's name calling, but not when it's an actual injustice.

Ok, I have no money on this market, and I'm gonna take a swing at it (using a point system):
The Certificate of Live Birth settles the rumors +1 point
it is not his actual Birth Certificate -1 point
most people colloquially accept this document as a "birth certificate" +1

these are the major arguments I see; it comes out to +1 point for the previous settlement

That may be skipper, but note the last line of the background:
"Market refers to Birth Certificate, not certificate of Live Birth."

was his birth name "Barry Dunham"?!?!?!

@all HD'S...i don't got a dog in this fight, but what caught my eye is 2 things. first trimath using the "capitol letters" deal in expressing his view. next time you get a phone, electric, cable, internet bill..etc look closely at how they spell your name. it won't be John Doe..it will be JOHN DOE. your name will be in all capitol letters. ask the biller why they do that and see what they tell ya. your name in all CAPS makes you a corpration is the reason they do it. have any of you ever signed your name in all caps? sorry for going off subject.

second thing fof has asked more than once is BHO'S birth name "Barry Dunham"?!?!?! more than once. i haven't cheked every link, could fof or somebody else tell me what link to use to see where BHO'S birth name is "Barry Dunham"? fof seems to be a reasonable fella so i'm guessing he didn't pull that out of no where. have a nice day.

p.s. i've disagreed with ryan more than once. i told him to get another catagory..something easy like technolgy. he said no way. somebody has to make the unpopular descions. goodluck with this one ryan.

@dieseldog - it's all speculation and conspiracy theories, further fueled by his not releasing his Birth Certificate.

"Barack even joked when was running for U.S. Senate that had he taken his mother's name he would be known as Barry Dunham instead of the more African name in honor of his father: Barack Hussein Obama."
http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=201618

"

OCTOBER SURPISE 2

Various off-site comments introduce other interesting opinions about the missing birth certificate:

6. That his name on the certificate is actually Barry with family name as Dunham.

9. In American immigration law a new born, born to only one US natural born citizen which in this case would be his mother — Ann Dunham - thus Barry Dunham would or should be on his birth certificate.

For him to change his name at birth to OBAMA his father would have had to ADOPT him, there is no evidence that he did this, thus his name remains Dunham.

When his mother remarried his name was changed to Soetoro but how? His new father would also have had to adopt him to change his name , and make him a citizen of Indonesia, however Barry returned to Honolulu somehow on his second father's passport.

His grandparents did not change Barry’s legal status, so for some reason he kept the name Soetoro until he changed it yet again to Barack Hussein Obama but he did not do it legally by deed poll thus he should still be using his real name."
http://noiri.blogspot.com/2008/06/october-surpise-2.html

There is no doubt in my mind that he's eligible to run for POTUS, but it certainly appears that there is something on his birth certificate that he doesn't want to have to explain or defend. In light of his possible Black Panther connections, it could be tedious to explain his choice of Barack Hussein Obama.

This is really getting silly. This market doesn't ask if there is a conspiracy going on, it doesn't ask if Obama's documents will be proven to be forged, it doesn't even ask what his real name is. Look at it, boys and girls!!
The market is: When will Barack Obama release his birth certificate?
Plain and simple.
We're all trying to read way too much into this.

PS @triamathametician: I'm not aware of the frequency of a birth certificate being interchanged with a certificate of live birth. It doesn't happen with the Social Security Dept. I tried.
You state, "it wasn't stated precisely in the initial question."
Geez, Louise!! How much more precise would you like morgie (the creator), to have been??
The market precisely asks; When will Barack Obama release his birth certificate?
He hasn't...yet.

You know, the more I hear about Obama, the more I feel insecure about the Democratic Party, and, the US as well.
I supported HRC until Obama became the presumptive nominee. Then, I gave him a really good lookover, hoping to see what it was that was enticing half the Democrats to his leadership. I came away not only lacking and real substance, but I feel betrayed.

Once he won the nomination, I figured I'd either vote for Obama, or at worst, not vote at all.

But as things stand now, I'm jumping across the aisle to vote for McCain. Oh, I'll still be voting Dem down the ticket, just not for President.

In this way, I figure, the Dem controlled congress can keep McSame in check for four years.

Amazing (looking out the window to see which way the wind is blowing before I place my next wager)
Integrity means you stick to your personal code of conduct. You stick to what you decide is right and wrong.
http://www.tipsforsuccess.org/truth.htm
Nothing like making a decision, then changing it, then saying: Oh, never mind...I meant what I said before.

bump

Well Cognos I see a lot of Democrats like you these days, even though I live in Obama's home state of IL where he won the senate with 80%+ of the popular vote.

The problem with Obama is his lack of experience, he hasn't been around once yet but he thinks that as president he can just make all these decisions and have them work, even though they haven't worked in the past. He really jumped the gun on running for president, because he would have been far more electable 8 years down the road in a party mostly undamaged after a few RDC wins, but here we are.

Even though I predict more dems voting for McCain then Reps voting for Obama, and McCain winning the election, I really do hope I'm wrong about Obama just in case he does win, becuase if he's half as naive as he sounds America will be half the nation it is now when he's had 4 years of diplomatic mistakes under his belt.

All that said, I still maintain that his birth certificate is a none issue.

To join the military, many years ago, I HAD to have my birth certificate. You know, to prove who I was, and where I came from, etc.

I don't see why Big O can't produce one, cause, you know, he IS running for POTUS.

@cognos: that is a very good point

Obama birth certificate question re-opened
http://www.stoptheaclu.com/archives/2008/06/19/obama-birth-certificate-question-re-opened/

Here is a copy of a

REAL

Hawaii Certification of Live Birth:
http://www.valeehill.net/genealogy/documents/doc_decosta_pat_birth.jpg

This is interesting:

Winnie the Pooh’s birth certificate more authentic than Obama’s
http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/3675

From the article:
“The failure of the Obama campaign to do so, and its willingness instead to put up an invalid, uncertified image—what now appears to be a crude forgery—raises the dramatic question of why the presumptive Democratic presidential candidate might have to hide."

A blogger quoted my comment #21 above!!!

http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/06/28/daily-kos-an-obama-activist-and-forged-birth-certifications/

He even credited my screen name
I almost fell famous :-D

That’s apparently why “fingers of fury” suggests that opendna’s posting is where the alleged forgeries may have originated…….presumably because they would be easier to alter
http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/06/28/daily-kos-an-obama-activist-and-forged-birth-certifications/

@fingers_of_fury: well done, famous one!

Here is an example of the real thing: http://snarkybytes.com/?p=521 It is a lot more complete!

A Forensic Expert now is on record as saying this COLB is a forgery http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2008/07/forensic-expert.html#comment-122155086

And Andy Martin proved that Barack was lying when he claimed his parents were married! http://www.pr-inside.com/barack-obama-panics-andy-martin-s-book-r700482.htm

This sure is getting interesting real fast

This is an interesting of what we know about Barack:

1. Occidental College records – Not released
2. Columbia College records – Not released
3. Columbia Thesis paper – “not available”
4. Harvard College records – Not released
5. Selective Service Registration – Not released
6. Medical records – Not released
7. Illinois State Senate records – “not available”
8. Illinois State Senate schedule – “not available”
9. Law practice client list – Not released
10. Certified Copy of original Birth certificate – Not released
11. Embossed, signed paper Certification of Live Birth – Not released
12. Harvard Law Review articles published – None
13. University of Chicago scholarly articles - None

( From Hillary Clintons Forum: http://www.hillaryclintonforum.net/discussion/showthread.php?p=262198 )

That new guy, the Lord Messiah Barack Hussien Obama, can't tell us anything about himself with specificity... it's above his pay-grade ;-)

Here is more on this saga:

"Why is Barack Obama paying Lawyers intead of producing his Birth Certificate?" http://yidwithlid.blogspot.com/2008/10/why-is-obama-paying-lawyers-instead-of.html

Tuesday, October 7, 2008
Why Is Obama Paying Lawyers Instead of Producing Birth Certificate?

Last week a Judge Ordered Senator to produce his birth certificate, Yesterday the Senator's lawyers have filed for a delay of the order. Now I know most people think that the "birth certificate" issue is as legitimate as the tooth fairy. But My question to them is, if it is so illegitimate, why is the Senator paying lawyers instead of just giving the birth certificate document to the Judge?

Obama has admitted dual citizenship:
“When Barack Obama Jr. was born on Aug. 4,1961, in Honolulu, Kenya was a British colony, still part of the United Kingdom’s dwindling empire. As a Kenyan native, Barack Obama Sr. was a British subject whose citizenship status was governed by The British Nationality Act of 1948. That same act governed the status of Obama Sr.‘s children.

Since Sen. Obama has neither renounced his U.S. citizenship nor sworn an oath of allegiance to Kenya, his Kenyan citizenship automatically expired on Aug. 4,1982.
http://fightthesmears.com/articles/5/birthcertificate

Photo Documents Barry Soetoro: Indonesian Citizen, Muslim Religion
This registration document, made available on Jan. 24, 2007, by the Fransiskus Assisi school in Jakarta, Indonesia, shows the registration of Barack Obama under the name Barry Soetoro into the Catholic school made by his step-father, Lolo Soetoro. The document lists Barry Soetoro as a Indonesian citizen, born on August 4, 1961 in Honolulu, and shows his Muslim step-father listed the boy's religion as Islam.(AP Photo/ Tatan Syuflana)
http://www.daylife.com/photo/01u33pL9Ns06D

If Lolo Soetoro adopted him he ceased to be a US Citizen in the mid 1960s, BY INDONESIAN LAW. He also ceased to be a Kenyan Citizen, BY INDONESIAN LAW. By Kenyan and US Law he retained his Original Citizenships, until his 21st Birthday. By Indonesian Law he could have given up Indonesian Citizenship at age 18, but did he? If he didn’t he was, albeit accidentally, displaying a Legal Intention to void his US Citizenship, since he knew he could not Legally hold both Citizenships.
http://texasdarlin.wordpress.com/2008/09/25/breaking-obama-admits-dual-citizenship/

Hawai’i Supreme Court asked to issue emergency writ opening secret Obama birth files

http://contrariancommentary.wordpress.com/2008/10/20/hawai%E2%80%99i-supreme-court-asked-to-issue-emergency-writ-opening-secret-obama-birth-files/

These might be released yet!

Wow! So that's three lawsuits in three states that I know of... something to keep his lawyers busy... unless he ends all this non-sense by just releasing his birth certificate already.

This is worth a read: http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

Yeah, there must be some reason they would prefer to show that piece of paper to someone other than a judge in a courtroom...

From the link Jenni posted:

"FactCheck.org staffers have now seen, touched, examined and photographed the original birth certificate. We conclude that it meets all of the requirements from the State Department for proving U.S. citizenship. Claims that the document lacks a raised seal or a signature are false. We have posted high-resolution photographs of the document as "supporting documents" to this article. Our conclusion: Obama was born in the U.S.A. just as he has always said."

One of the lawsuits was dismissed last night. http://www.americasright.com/2008/10/lawsuit-against-obama-dismissed-from.html Mr Berg, the Democrat lawyer who had filed the suit, says he will appeal.

Berg said he is in possession of a native-language audiotape of Sarah Obama, Barack Obama's paternal grandmother, stating on the day of the last presidential debate that her famous grandson was indeed born in Kenya, and that she was present in the hospital for his birth.

"The tape is in the native language there," Berg said. "I will release it as soon as translation is confirmed by affidavit, and we are waiting on affidavits from contacts over here and in Kenya."

emmag - as i've said before i don't think theres nothing to this whole deal. if you go look at the site jenni posted and the pic on that the site, as well as the one on obama's website it is NOT</> a birth certificate. it's a certificate of live birth. the guy in PA was suing to see the (vault) birth certificate. i'm no lawyer, but supposely there's a difference between the two documents.

the judge said berg didn't prove he would be harmed, and he didn't have "standing" to bring the suit.

So, who does have standing? According to the Hon. R. Barclay Surrick, that's completely up to Congress to decide.

If, through the political process, Congress determines that citizens, voters, or party members should police the Constitution’s eligibility requirements for the Presidency, then it is free to pass laws conferring standing on individuals like Plaintiff. Until that time, voters do not have standing to bring the sort of challenge that Plaintiff attempts to bring in the Amended Complaint.

things have been quitely lately with no dragonfang around. i look forward to reading his comments. maybe the secert service picked him up for questioning. :O)

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D941NCJG0&show_article=1&catnum=3

So, Barack was in Hawaii. I heard that the Governor of Hawaii sealed his birth certificate. Has anyone heard how grandma is doing? The only thing I heard was when they reported Barack had spent about an hour with her, but I kind of lost track after that.

First Court Hearing on Obama's Birth Certificate on Tuesday, Nov 18, 2008
http://www.rightsidenews.com/200811162625/editorial/first-court-hearing-on-obama-s-birth-certificate-on-tuesday-nov-18-2008.html